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Saṁyutta Nikāya — The Connected Discourses

SN11: Connected Discourses with Sakka

SN11:5 Victory by Well-Spoken Counsel

1At Sāvatthī. "Bhikkhus, once in the past the devas and the asuras were arrayed for battle. Then Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, said to Sakka, lord of the devas: ‘Lord of the devas, let there be victory by well-spoken counsel.’ (And Sakka replied:) ‘Vepacitti, let there be victory by well-spoken counsel.’ "Then, bhikkhus, the devas and the asuras appointed a panel of judges, saying: ‘These will ascertain what has been well spoken and badly spoken by us.’

1Sāvatthinidānaṁ. "Bhūtapubbaṁ, bhikkhave, devāsurasaṅgāmo samupabyūḷho ahosi. Atha kho, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo sakkaṁ devānamindaṁ etadavoca: ‘hotu, devānaminda, subhāsitena jayo’ti. ‘Hotu, vepacitti, subhāsitena jayo’ti. Atha kho, bhikkhave, devā ca asurā ca pārisajje ṭhapesuṁ: ‘ime no subhāsitadubbhāsitaṁ ājānissantī’ti.

"Then Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, said to Sakka, lord of the devas: ‘Speak a verse, lord of the devas.’

Atha kho, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo sakkaṁ devānamindaṁ etadavoca: ‘bhaṇa, devānaminda, gāthan’ti.



When this was said, Sakka said to Vepacitti: ‘You, Vepacitti, being the senior deva here, speak a verse.’[n.619] Tumhe khvettha vepacitti pubbadeva. Spk paraphrases: "Being the senior master long residing in the deva world, speak what has been transmitted to you." Spk-pṭ: Because he had arisen in this world earlier than Sakka and his retinue of devas, he is extolled as "the senior deva" (pubbadeva, lit. "former deva"). He addresses Vepacitti with plural forms as a sign of respect.
Both Spk (to SN11.1) and Dhp-a I 272–73 relate how Sakka ousted the old generation of devas and drove them out to the asura world; see BL 1:319.
sn.i.223 When this was said, Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, recited this verse:[n.620] The verses of Vepacitti are identical with those of Mātali in the preceding sutta, and Sakka's verses here are identical with his own verses above.

Evaṁ vutte, bhikkhave, sakko devānamindo vepacittiṁ asurindaṁ etadavoca: ‘tumhe khvettha, vepacitti, pubbadevā. Bhaṇa, vepacitti, gāthan’ti. Evaṁ vutte, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo imaṁ gāthaṁ abhāsi: 

2v.883 "‘Fools would vent their anger even more
If no one would keep them in check.
Hence with drastic punishment
The wise man should restrain the fool.’

2‘Bhiyyo bālā pabhijjeyyuṁ,
no cassa paṭisedhako;
Tasmā bhusena daṇḍena,
dhīro bālaṁ nisedhaye’ti.

3"When, bhikkhus, Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, spoke this verse, the asuras applauded but the devas were silent. Then Vepacitti said to Sakka: ‘Speak a verse, lord of the devas.’ When this was said, Sakka, lord of the devas, recited this verse:

3Bhāsitāya kho pana, bhikkhave, vepacittinā asurindena gāthāya asurā anumodiṁsu, devā tuṇhī ahesuṁ. Atha kho, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo sakkaṁ devānamindaṁ etadavoca: ‘bhaṇa, devānaminda, gāthan’ti. Evaṁ vutte, bhikkhave, sakko devānamindo imaṁ gāthaṁ abhāsi: 

4v.884 "‘I myself think this alone
Is the way to check the fool:
When one knows one's foe is angry
One mindfully maintains one's peace.’

4‘Etadeva ahaṁ maññe,
bālassa paṭisedhanaṁ;
Paraṁ saṅkupitaṁ ñatvā,
yo sato upasammatī’ti.

5"When, bhikkhus, Sakka, lord of the devas, spoke this verse, the devas applauded but the asuras were silent. Then Sakka said to Vepacitti: ‘Speak a verse, Vepacitti.’ When this was said, Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, recited this verse:

5Bhāsitāya kho pana, bhikkhave, sakkena devānamindena gāthāya, devā anumodiṁsu, asurā tuṇhī ahesuṁ. Atha kho, bhikkhave, sakko devānamindo vepacittiṁ asurindaṁ etadavoca: ‘bhaṇa, vepacitti, gāthan’ti. Evaṁ vutte, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo imaṁ gāthaṁ abhāsi: 

6v.885 "‘I see this fault, O Vāsavā,
In practising patient endurance:
When the fool thinks of you thus,
"He endures me out of fear,"
The dolt will chase you even more
As a bull does one who flees.’

6‘Etadeva titikkhāya,
vajjaṁ passāmi vāsava;
Yadā naṁ maññati bālo,
bhayā myāyaṁ titikkhati;
Ajjhāruhati dummedho,
gova bhiyyo palāyinan’ti.



7"When, bhikkhus, Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, spoke this verse, the asuras applauded but the devas were silent. Then Vepacitti said to Sakka: ‘Speak a verse, lord of the devas.’ When this was said, Sakka, lord of the devas, recited these verses:

7Bhāsitāya kho pana, bhikkhave, vepacittinā asurindena gāthāya asurā anumodiṁsu, devā tuṇhī ahesuṁ. Atha kho, bhikkhave, vepacitti asurindo sakkaṁ devānamindaṁ etadavoca: ‘bhaṇa, devānaminda, gāthan’ti. Evaṁ vutte, bhikkhave, sakko devānamindo imā gāthāyo abhāsi: 

8v.886 "‘Let it be whether or not he thinks,
"He endures me out of fear,"
Of goals that culminate in one's own good
None is found better than patience.[n.621a] I translate pādas cd guided by Spk's paraphrase: "Among the goals (or goods) which culminate in one's own good, there is found no other goal (or good) better than patience" (tesu saka-atthaparamesu atthesu khantito uttaritaro añño attho na vijjati). Because of the discrepancy between the plural sadatthaparama attha in pāda c and the singular verb vijjati in pāda d, it seems necessary to read the nominative clause in pāda c as doing service for a locative or genitive, as Spk suggests, with a singular subject implicit. The only alternative would be to amend pāda c to read singular sadatthaparamo attho, but no text has this reading. Cp. v. 854d above and v. 895d below. Ñāṇamoli splits the two pādas syntactically and translates: "One's own good is the best of all, and there is none surpasses patience" (The Guide, p. 227), but this seems too free. Note that Sakka speaks from the perspective of mundane ethical values rather than from the transcendent perspective of the Dhamma. From that perspective sadattha is identified with arahantship, which cannot be gained simply by patience.

9v.887 "‘When a person endowed with strength
Patiently endures a weakling,
They call that the supreme patience;
The weakling must be patient always.[n.622a] C.Rh.D takes niccaṁ khamati dubbalo to mean that a weak person must always be tolerated (see KS 1:285), but dubbalo, as nominative, is clearly the subject of khamati, not its object. My translation conforms to Ñāṇamoli's (in Minor Readings and Illustrator, p. 162), but was made independently. Ñāṇamoli's note speaks for my interpretation as well: "The rendering here … seeks to bring out that patience is a necessity rather than a virtue in the weak, but appears as a virtue in the forbearance of the strong. The verse is a difficult one."

10v.888 "‘They call that strength no strength at all—
The strength that is the strength of folly—
But no one can reproach a person
Who is strong because guarded by Dhamma.[n.623a] Spk: Dhammaguttassa: to one who is protected by the Dhamma or to one who is protecting the Dhamma (dhammena rakkhitassa dhammaṁ va rakkhantassa).

11v.889 "‘One who repays an angry man with angersn.i.224
Thereby makes things worse for himself.
Not repaying an angry man with anger,
One wins a battle hard to win.

12v.890 "‘He practises for the welfare of both,
His own and the other's,
When, knowing that his foe is angry,
He mindfully maintains his peace.

13891 "‘When he achieves the cure of both—
His own and the other's—
The people who consider him a fool
Are unskilled in the Dhamma.’

8‘Kāmaṁ maññatu vā mā vā,
bhayā myāyaṁ titikkhati;
Sadatthaparamā atthā,
khantyā bhiyyo na vijjati.

9Yo have balavā santo,
dubbalassa titikkhati;
Tamāhu paramaṁ khantiṁ,
niccaṁ khamati dubbalo.

10Abalaṁ taṁ balaṁ āhu,
yassa bālabalaṁ balaṁ;
Balassa dhammaguttassa,
paṭivattā na vijjati.

11Tasseva tena pāpiyo,
yo kuddhaṁ paṭikujjhati;
Kuddhaṁ appaṭikujjhanto,
saṅgāmaṁ jeti dujjayaṁ.

12Ubhinnamatthaṁ carati,
attano ca parassa ca;
Paraṁ saṅkupitaṁ ñatvā,
yo sato upasammati.

13Ubhinnaṁ tikicchantānaṁ,
attano ca parassa ca;
Janā maññanti bāloti,
ye dhammassa akovidā’ti.



14"When, bhikkhus, these verses were spoken by Sakka, lord of the devas, the devas applauded but the asuras were silent. Then the panel of judges appointed by the devas and the asuras said this: ‘The verses spoken by Vepacitti, lord of the asuras, are in the sphere of punishment and violence; hence (they entail) conflict, contention, and strife. But the verses spoken by Sakka, lord of the devas, are in the sphere of nonpunishment and nonviolence; hence (they entail) freedom from conflict, freedom from contention, and freedom from strife. Sakka, lord of the devas, has won the victory by well-spoken counsel.’

14Bhāsitāsu kho pana, bhikkhave, sakkena devānamindena gāthāsu, devā anumodiṁsu, asurā tuṇhī ahesuṁ. Atha kho, bhikkhave, devānañca asurānañca pārisajjā etadavocuṁ: ‘bhāsitā kho vepacittinā asurindena gāthāyo. Tā ca kho sadaṇḍāvacarā sasatthāvacarā, iti bhaṇḍanaṁ iti viggaho iti kalaho. Bhāsitā kho sakkena devānamindena gāthāyo. Tā ca kho adaṇḍāvacarā asatthāvacarā, iti abhaṇḍanaṁ iti aviggaho iti akalaho. Sakkassa devānamindassa subhāsitena jayo’ti.

"In this way, bhikkhus, Sakka, lord of the devas, won the victory by well-spoken counsel."

Iti kho, bhikkhave, sakkassa devānamindassa subhāsitena jayo ahosī"ti.